A concern about the rally point issue and a way the concern could be addressed

[retfarcimak]

I'm concerned that the rally point system talked about in the comments on the news post about update 64 will have the same problems of a similar concept in a game known as Heroes & Generals: The APC. When players spawn in an APC, 9 times out of 10, and enemy will have found the APC and will be camping it for kills, killing the players spawning before they even have a chance to fight. This could go on for several minutes unless someone managed to sneak up on him, certainly not someone spawning in the APC.

The could be fixed with a simple warning system. Basically, when trying to spawn on the rally point, if there was an enemy that was within view of it, it would alert the person spawning that there might be a threat upon spawning, preparing them so they can be at least somewhat ready when they spawn. I don't know how the spawn system would be done to preserve authenticity, but it could be something subtle. Maybe a certain audio or visual que when clicking on it, perhaps?

 

[Aniallator]

I assume you haven't played Project Reality or Squad, but those games have rallypoints and are where the concept of rallies in TW originated. In those games, when a rally does get camped - which isn't too often considering a) they're small and unnoticeable to begin with, and b) they disappear when enemies come within ~10 meters - a squad member will simply say over VOIP "Rally's hot, don't spawn on it!" Like PR/Squad, from which TW derives some inspiration, TW will have a certain reliance on squad members communicating with one another and with their squad leader (something impossible in H&G). It works seamlessly in PR/Squad, I'm truly not worried about it in TW.

 

[retfarcimak]

I assume you haven't played Project Reality or Squad, but those games have rallypoints and are where the concept of rallies in TW originated. In those games, when a rally does get camped - which isn't too often considering a) they're small and unnoticeable to begin with, and b) they disappear when enemies come within ~10 meters - a squad member will simply say over VOIP "Rally's hot, don't spawn on it!" Like PR/Squad, from which TW derives some inspiration, TW will have a certain reliance on squad members communicating with one another and with their squad leader (something impossible in H&G). It works seamlessly in PR/Squad, I'm truly not worried about it in TW.

Alright, thanks for clearing that up. ^^ You're right, i haven't played either, I don't really have the money yet (that's why H&G was for the longest time the only FPS I played) but it seems like a good way to solve the spawn camping problem. Though from the sound of it, it seemed like the enemy could destroy it voluntarily with their weaponry when spotted.

 

[agus92]

PR/Squad rallies are just destroyed when enemies walk by in a 50 meter radius (PR, dunno Squad), so no need to shoot them or anything. This prevents any kind of spawn camping, as long as the rally is not in the most open field of the map. Certainly TW could change that, but I don't truly see the value in doing so.

Btw, Project Reality (PR) is free.

 

[calgoblin]

I think it comes down to the NCO being made aware that one has been compromised and moving it. If they are destroyable and the enemy chooses not to destroy it then I think that's a valid tactic. I also like to think that with our 3D audio locating rallypoints would be quite fun

 

[agus92]

ooh, interesting...

 

[FlyingR]

I think it comes down to the NCO being made aware that one has been compromised and moving it. If they are destroyable and the enemy chooses not to destroy it then I think that's a valid tactic. I also like to think that with our 3D audio locating rallypoints would be quite fun

I have a question regarding the 3D audio. Let's say that the SL/NCO died at the objective and respawned in the Rally and died again due to someone camping it and is in the spawn menu countdown thingy waiting to spawn and let's say the rest of the section are still trying capture the objective.

Will the SL/NCO be able to communicate somehow to the rest of the section, meaning that there will be "Section" mumble as well as some sort of "Local" mumble (where only people in x meters radius from you can hear you talk) or will it just be "Local", meaning the SL/NCO wouldn't be able to tell your Section that he's been camped at the Rally point.

 

[Flare]

I have a question regarding the 3D audio. Let's say that the SL/NCO died at the objective and respawned in the Rally and died again due to someone camping it and is in the spawn menu countdown thingy waiting to spawn and let's say the rest of the section are still trying capture the objective.

Will the SL/NCO be able to communicate somehow to the rest of the section, meaning that there will be "Section" mumble as well as some sort of "Local" mumble (where only people in x meters radius from you can hear you talk) or will it just be "Local", meaning the SL/NCO wouldn't be able to tell your Section that he's been camped at the Rally point.

I have been wondering about this a lot as well.

Sure, only having local would be more realistic, but it would make coordinating, especially when squad members are dead, really hard. But if there was squad radio then local would only be really used to talk to blueberries...

Maybe when you talk when you are dead it goes to your whole squad as well as local, but when you are alive you can only talk on local? But there are problems there as well...

 

[retfarcimak]

PR/Squad rallies are just destroyed when enemies walk by in a 50 meter radius (PR, dunno Squad), so no need to shoot them or anything. This prevents any kind of spawn camping, as long as the rally is not in the most open field of the map. Certainly TW could change that, but I don't truly see the value in doing so.

Btw, Project Reality (PR) is free.

Alright, sounds like it'd be safer. ^^ And cool, thanks, I'll go ahead and check that out.

 

[Aniallator]

PR/Squad rallies are just destroyed when enemies walk by in a 50 meter radius (PR, dunno Squad)

Yeah, it's ~10 meters in Squad. It will have to be something similar in TW given that maps won't be 4 km PR maps, and personally find PR rallies fairly useless given how far away an enemy can be when he destroys it.
[MENTION=4739]retfarcimak[/MENTION] PR is free, in fact if you hop onto the TW Discord you can probably find some of us to play it with you

I have been wondering about this a lot as well.

Sure, only having local would be more realistic, but it would make coordinating, especially when squad members are dead, really hard. But if there was squad radio then local would only be really used to talk to blueberries...

Maybe when you talk when you are dead it goes to your whole squad as well as local, but when you are alive you can only talk on local? But there are problems there as well...

Yeah, this has been on my mind as well... I totally spaced it when replying to this thread. Especially in WW2 FPS, I hate the idea of squad radio, and generally speaking I think being limited to local would be fine... *except* when it comes to spawns being camped.

What about this: if a squad member dies within ~10 meters of a rally, a red outline (or something to that effect) appears around the rally icon on the map; this way squad members will know if a rally is hot. The only other local-only issue I can foresee is the SL not being able to tell people where to respawn.

 

[retfarcimak]

I think it comes down to the NCO being made aware that one has been compromised and moving it. If they are destroyable and the enemy chooses not to destroy it then I think that's a valid tactic. I also like to think that with our 3D audio locating rallypoints would be quite fun

That would also be a good way to handle that, now there are three choices in this thread of how this spawn protection could be done. :3 I think all of them are cool ways it could be done. For your version, how about having to have the squad protect the rallypoint until they can pick it back up? It could take a few seconds to pick it back up to move it.

 

[FlyingR]

Yeah, this has been on my mind as well... I totally spaced it when replying to this thread. Especially in WW2 FPS, I hate the idea of squad radio, and generally speaking I think being limited to local would be fine... *except* when it comes to spawns being camped.

What about this: if a squad member dies within ~10 meters of a rally, a red outline (or something to that effect) appears around the rally icon on the map; this way squad members will know if a rally is hot. The only other local-only issue I can foresee is the SL not being able to tell people where to respawn.

I don't think that a red outline or w.e should appear, but I think that's a fair idea because yes, if NCO or anyone else is dead, how will they communicate?Being able to talk to the section when you are dead it's not bad suggestion either. What I like about Local only is that it basically obliges the whole squad to be together plus the extreme immersion in it, as in if you separate from your section, good luck trying to survive!

As we said in different posts, maybe have different options for each server for the level of difficulty, where you have Arcade, Realism and Custom, in which Arcade there is Section mumble and Realism there is just Local unless you die, for example.

 

[Aniallator]

As we said in different posts, maybe have different options for each server for the level of difficulty, where you have Arcade, Realism and Custom, in which Arcade there is Section mumble and Realism there is just Local unless you die, for example.

Yeah this is a good point, just have different levels of difficulty available for servers.

 

[Flare]

As we said in different posts, maybe have different options for each server for the level of difficulty, where you have Arcade, Realism and Custom, in which Arcade there is Section mumble and Realism there is just Local unless you die, for example.

Personally I am against having different realism settings. I don't think TW will have a massive community of 10s and 100s of thousands of players, and if I want to play realism and the only populated servers are Arcade or vice versa, then I might not have an enjoyable time. I'd rather have a few server options but I'd prefer if my game experience was the same rules each time. Even in Battlefield 1 which sold millions of copies it can be hard to find a game that's the mode you want to play because the community is so split between more options and paid DLCs, etc. Anything that can split the community is a bad thing in my books.